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Post by g4hardcore on Nov 13, 2014 16:20:46 GMT
  ...Titans and Highbreed litter the battlefield, their mangled and bloody forms creating a putrid stench in the air. Eren roared as Humungousaur bellowed, then the two faced each other menacingly, as if they were sworn enemies from the very beginning. Battle frenzied, the two giants bounded toward each other, shaking the ground with every footfall. Jaeger would kill Ben if it were the last thing he did, and Ben would not let that happen so long as he drew breath. As they collided, sending shockwaves throughout the non-existent city that was the setting, the two onlookers that had brought them to the city smiled in cruel delight.<br><br>"Thanks to you, these two will kill each other or die trying, completely indiscriminate." The stranger engulfed in shadow commented. His 'partner' nodded. "And thanks to you, this event was possible in the first place. We make a good team." "Yes," the first man replied with a strange tone. "...team..." |
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Post by omfg on Nov 13, 2014 21:58:50 GMT
I haven't watch Attack On Titan since the first couple of episodes, and I haven't watch Ben 10 since the original series, but with Google as my guide, I think I've developed a fairly good answer. Here goes. Firstly, let's analyze the size difference of these two, and one literally, Titans. Eren Yeager, as a Titan, was originally 3-6 Meters (9"8-19"6 Ft) tall. As he grew older, he eventually maxed out to his current size of 15 Meters (49"2 Ft) of height. Humungosaur, however is only 12 Feet (3.6 Meters) tall in base form. Due to the fact that they just got finished fighting, we can assume he is at full size which is 60 Feet (18.28 Meters) tall. Height wise, Humungosaur takes it. Now, let's analyze their fighting ability. Eren, has had 7 years of intense military training, which includes martial arts. After he learned to control his Titan form, he constantly fought and defeated Titans many times bigger then him, with rather ease. Watch this video, it shows him dominating a group of 10-15 Titans, picking one up, keep in mind said Titan was bigger then him, with his teeth and using him as a hammer. Video Ben, has had his Omnitrix for 2 years (Assuming this is Omniverse). He has had no formal training, and has only no one his full size. Fighting Experience wise, Eren takes it. Let's look at Speed. Eren is extremely fast, even faster then his Titan enemies. Show in the video above, he is able to cross a street block in a single stride. He is faster, and thanks to his human-like form, he can maneuver faster, shown in the video where he managed to get a Titan bigger then him in a arm-lock. Humungousaur, however, is slow. In fact, in the Ben 10 Wikia, it states " Weaknesses
: ...He is also very slow and can't fit into small spaces" (Bold added for effect). In this video, we see him in action. Speed-wise, Eren takes it. Finally, let's look at Strength. In the video provided, Eren is able to beat several Titans his size, and some bigger. He over-powers three that are biting him, and picks up a Titan several meters taller then him just with his teeth, he then proceeds to use said Titan as a bat to hit another Titan. In another video, we see him carrying a boulder that is his height, across a couple of city blocks.  Since we have nothing to compare that with today, let's use a block from the The Khufu-pyramid, Cheops (Just to get some idea of the weight.) Now here are the dimensions of the blocks, the average of 127 x 127 x 71cm (Or 1.27 M x 1.27 M x .71 M). The average stone weighs 1.5 tonnes. The blocks were made out of limestone, which according to this website, is heavier then concrete As we see, the boulder is a little bit bigger then Eren, so seeing as the boulder seems to have the same dimensions all around I'll say its about 1600 x 1600 x 1500cm (or 16 M x 16 M x 15 M) seeing as the boulder is 15 times bigger then the block, we can say the boulder weighs about 24 tonnes, however due to the fact that Limestone weighs less then concrete, we have to round that down to 20 tonnes.
So, we can see Eren carry around 20 tonnes, with difficulty. For Humungosaur, we don't have these specific shots. We can see in the video posted above, that in his base form, he falls under the weight of the Alien-thing. While we don't know the exact weight of this Alien, we can see it's a little bit bigger then Base Humungousaur, so we'd put it as about 8 meters. On the Ben 10 wikia, it says that at his max, Humungosaur can lift Way Big, who is after some calculations, this guy he's around 220 feet, or 67 meters tall. That's alot. Strength Wise, it's a TiePoints to consider: Omnitrix running out, Eren transforming back, Eren's regeneration.With all of this considered, I think Eren is fast enough, and has more experience than Humungosaur, and will be able to out-maneuver him. Winner: Eren |
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Post by g4hardcore on Nov 13, 2014 22:40:25 GMT
I like your research, it shows a lot of depth man. For the sake of the fight, the watch will not time out; he is for all intents and purposes, stuck in the Humungousaur persona. When the Omnitrix times out, it's usually at random times, so to keep that weakness would be unfair to the integrity of the fight.
A note, your estimation of Eren's strength is a good estimate, but it should be in no way taken at face value. I don't mean to discredit your math, but we have no idea of the composition of the boulder he lifted. It could be 15 tons, it could be thirty. Also, Eren is in his blue eyed form, meaning his strength and speed receive something of an adrenaline boost. Not that he needed the boost in speed, but he did need the boost in strength to even the odds. A maxed out Humungousaur is arguably stronger than a non-boosted Eren. Though since it's somewhat debatable, I won't speculate for the moment.
Most of what you said was spot on though, thanks for the view!
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Post by omfg on Nov 13, 2014 22:52:47 GMT
Oh, no problem G, you're my pal! Apart from that I was waiting for dinner to be finished cooking and had about 20 minutes of spare time...
Anyways, will this Humongo turn into Ultimate form? If he does, then just forget everything I posted, since he doubles in size and strength.
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Post by g4hardcore on Nov 14, 2014 0:00:56 GMT
No, his ultimate form has missile launchers for knuckles. I can't find a part of me that thinks that's fair, considering he's bigger and possibly stronger that base Eren. Ironically, I started cooking dinner as soon as I posted that last comment. Gotta love fried chicken!
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Post by omfg on Nov 14, 2014 0:34:53 GMT
No, his ultimate form has missile launchers for knuckles. I can't find a part of me that thinks that's fair, considering he's bigger and possibly stronger that base Eren. Ironically, I started cooking dinner as soon as I posted that last comment. Gotta love fried chicken! Lol, plus the fact that he grows to 120 ft tall, I just couldn't see that happening  |
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Post by Indolent on Nov 14, 2014 5:20:47 GMT
Uh... Ben actually has six years experience fighting and using the Omnitrix (He was ten in the original series, is sixteen in Omniverse aside flashbacks to his younger years). He has received training from the Plumber Academy, was trained by Gwen in karate, etc, etc. He relies on free-form hand to hand, and is actually pretty skilled, able to disarmed other trained individuals with ease. Not only that but yes, while he is slow for his size, which is the important component here, he's still agile enough to pull off somersaults, slides, and can dodge attacks. He was also capable of throwing an object into near orbit, which is a fairly great feat in terms of strength. He is also capable of rendering shockwaves with mere blows. Which should lend credence to my claim of his being the superior strength. You've already referenced lifting Way Big. He has armoring as well, and could be construed as similar to the Armored Titan. Not only that but said armoring (dem spikes) might make it harder for him to be taken down like how Eren did the Armored Titan (I read the manga.) And he's actually fought several entities his size. In fact, various aliens of his have typically fought people of equal size on most occasions. This lends credence to the sheer amount of experience Ben has in this area anyways. Maybe reevaluate your findings. Edit: Also, a point of interest: Imagine abusing the alteration of your ability to shift size as to throw off your opponent? Ben is certainly crafty as to do so.  |
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Post by g4hardcore on Nov 14, 2014 5:49:24 GMT
I was counting on strength feats for Humungousaur to arise here, and I knew about his orbit toss, which is why I felt I had no choice but to make Eren step it up via adrenaline mode.
How far ahead is the manga compared to the anime? I can't really think of a good feat in terms of strength for Eren while in rage. I know that it multiplies his strength and speed, as he was able to defeat Annie while missing limbs. We know Eren is faster, and frankly, he'll need it. His regeneration will likely come in handy too. While Humungousaur is armored, armor only goes skin deep. As unbreakable as Annie's (semi) armor was, Eren found a way around it.
The best question, is exactly how durable is Ben's alien? I feel a case could be made for the both of them being able to break each other's necks, at the very least.
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Post by omfg on Nov 14, 2014 11:40:53 GMT
Whoops, there goes my 20 minutes of half-assed research. I guess it's due to the fact that I never watched Alien Force or Omniverse. I'm still going to try to debate just because I need some experience under my belt as match annalist for this project I have coming up. Ben actually has six years experience fighting and using the Omnitrix (He was ten in the original series, is sixteen in Omniverse aside flashbacks to his younger years). He has received training from the Plumber Academy, was trained by Gwen in karate, etc, etc. He relies on free-form hand to hand, and is actually pretty skilled, able to disarmed other trained individuals with ease. My bad, I didn't realize he was 16, I thought he was 12, I forgot that Alien Force is 5 years later. Nonetheless, I don't take back my original statement that Eren has more experience. Humungo was first introduced in the second episode of Alien Force, when Ben was 15. If we add 1 more year and bring it to Omniverse, Ben only has 1 year of experience as Humungo. Which isn't really that much of a difference, since Eren only had about a year of being a controlled Titan anyway. What we have to look at though, is that Ben's training is suited for a Human Being, which Humungo is far from. Eren two, is trained as a Human, but the Titan is roughly the same proportionate wise as a human being. So, given that they have almost the same amount of experience, Eren can utilize it more due to his Titan's natural human-like shape. Not only that but yes, while he is slow for his size, which is the important component here, he's still agile enough to pull off somersaults, slides, and can dodge attacks. Yes, but like we see in the video I posted, that's base sized Humungo, not 60 feet tall Humungo. It's stated that as he grows bigger, he grows slower with size. At his full height, he would be considerably slower. He was also capable of throwing an object into near orbit, which is a fairly great feat in terms of strength. He is also capable of rendering shockwaves with mere blows. Which should lend credence to my claim of his being the superior strength. You've already referenced lifting Way Big. True, although it was just a flying scooter, I can't really argue that . Also, the Way Big feat was told by the Creator of Ben 10, but it was never actually shown, so that shouldn't be counted. It would be like Akira Toriyama saying Goku can fart out black holes, but since it's not shown in the Manga/Anime, it shouldn't be taken as truth. He has armoring as well, and could be construed as similar to the Armored Titan. Not only that but said armoring (dem spikes) might make it harder for him to be taken down like how Eren did the Armored Titan (I read the manga.) Armored Titan:  Full Sized Humungo:  One can argue that the Titan has more armor, but we can't really tell. And he's actually fought several entities his size. In fact, various aliens of his have typically fought people of equal size on most occasions. This lends credence to the sheer amount of experience Ben has in this area anyways. I'm talking about 60 foot tall Humungo fighting someone around 60 feet tall, if he has can you provide a video, or at least a wiki page? Would be much appreciated. Maybe reevaluate your findings. Edit: Also, a point of interest: Imagine abusing the alteration of your ability to shift size as to throw off your opponent? Ben is certainly crafty as to do so. Well, I should , but keep in mind I'm not caught up with either of the shows, I'm just arguing for the sake of arguing. I'm sure the second Ben goes a little bit smaller to trip up Eren his strength will decrease enough for him to get hurt  |
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Post by Indolent on Nov 14, 2014 15:27:44 GMT
Oh god, it's been forever since I've screwed around with forum quotes and posts. Whoops, there goes my 20 minutes of half-assed research. I guess it's due to the fact that I never watched Alien Force or Omniverse. I'm still going to try to debate just because I need some experience under my belt as match annalist for this project I have coming up. Ben actually has six years experience fighting and using the Omnitrix (He was ten in the original series, is sixteen in Omniverse aside flashbacks to his younger years). He has received training from the Plumber Academy, was trained by Gwen in karate, etc, etc. He relies on free-form hand to hand, and is actually pretty skilled, able to disarmed other trained individuals with ease. My bad, I didn't realize he was 16, I thought he was 12, I forgot that Alien Force is 5 years later. Nonetheless, I don't take back my original statement that Eren has more experience. Humungo was first introduced in the second episode of Alien Force, when Ben was 15. If we add 1 more year and bring it to Omniverse, Ben only has 1 year of experience as Humungo. Which isn't really that much of a difference, since Eren only had about a year of being a controlled Titan anyway. What we have to look at though, is that Ben's training is suited for a Human Being, which Humungo is far from. Eren two, is trained as a Human, but the Titan is roughly the same proportionate wise as a human being. So, given that they have almost the same amount of experience, Eren can utilize it more due to his Titan's natural human-like shape. Keep in mind, I was correcting you on the level of experience, not insinuating Ben was superior. Now that we have it this way, one could say Ben has a stronger case, no? Also Humungousaur is still a fairly humanoid shape and Ben has proven to be capable of utilizing new alien forms with some degree of ease. A year's experience is plenty, more so that it's not different from Eren having the same for his Titan form. Though I'm not sure if it's even been a year for Eren but I have stopped reading the manga since, the primary source material. Not only that but yes, while he is slow for his size, which is the important component here, he's still agile enough to pull off somersaults, slides, and can dodge attacks. Yes, but like we see in the video I posted, that's base sized Humungo, not 60 feet tall Humungo. It's stated that as he grows bigger, he grows slower with size. At his full height, he would be considerably slower. He's still considerably agile for his size was the point I was intending to make. He isn't by far a plodding sucker that can't fight the likes of Eren. Yes, I admit Eren is likely faster in the sense of hand to hand but that does not mean Humungousaur can't fight him, in a sense. More so since there's armor and strength to consider.  He was also capable of throwing an object into near orbit, which is a fairly great feat in terms of strength. He is also capable of rendering shockwaves with mere blows. Which should lend credence to my claim of his being the superior strength. You've already referenced lifting Way Big. True, although it was just a flying scooter, I can't really argue that . Also, the Way Big feat was told by the Creator of Ben 10, but it was never actually shown, so that shouldn't be counted. It would be like Akira Toriyama saying Goku can fart out black holes, but since it's not shown in the Manga/Anime, it shouldn't be taken as truth. Actually, Dwayne McDuffie's words are the Word of God in respect to the canon. If he says Way Big is Ben's sixth most powerful alien, we wouldn't discount this. The same for the strength example. This almost makes me think you're attempting to remove this feat in order to bolster your argument, otherwise you would not have brought it up first. Not only that, but that analogy is just silly. We also still would take Akira's accounts on the matter of Super Saiyan God Goku being a six to Bill's ten where Whis is a fifteen over him in terms of actual firepower. He has armoring as well, and could be construed as similar to the Armored Titan. Not only that but said armoring (dem spikes) might make it harder for him to be taken down like how Eren did the Armored Titan (I read the manga.) Armored Titan: Full Sized Humungo: One can argue that the Titan has more armor, but we can't really tell. I could argue that the weapons that Humungousaur has withstood energy blasters and the like, could prove to make a strong case. More so that it seems to be spread far more evenly than the Armor Titan. He had openings within his joints. Take a closer look. And this durability grows as he gets larger as well. And he's actually fought several entities his size. In fact, various aliens of his have typically fought people of equal size on most occasions. This lends credence to the sheer amount of experience Ben has in this area anyways. I'm talking about 60 foot tall Humungo fighting someone around 60 feet tall, if he has can you provide a video, or at least a wiki page? Would be much appreciated. In the wiki page, it gives you instances by episodes in the history. There are a few entities there that you can check out yourself. Le Historie. There would be other instances but you'll have to check out the other aliens. Maybe reevaluate your findings. Edit: Also, a point of interest: Imagine abusing the alteration of your ability to shift size as to throw off your opponent? Ben is certainly crafty as to do so. Well, I should , but keep in mind I'm not caught up with either of the shows, I'm just arguing for the sake of arguing. I'm sure the second Ben goes a little bit smaller to trip up Eren his strength will decrease enough for him to get hurt I'm fairly certain his durability would still be enough, even at base. I'm noticing you kinda skimmed the wiki more than actually thoroughly read it as well. Not that I mean any offense by it. Mind you, I'm not saying Ben roflstomps Eren. He can certainly win, as can Eren. |
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Post by omfg on Nov 14, 2014 15:40:29 GMT
This is just turning into a mess , the old site had a better quoting system. You're right though, I did kind of skim through the wiki, there's about 200000 articles on everything, so I didn't bother Oh well, it could go either way, is what I'm trying to say. I don't favorite either so decent argument, it was fun |
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Post by Indolent on Nov 14, 2014 16:18:02 GMT
Indeeeeeeeed. I'm a wikia whore anyways but also lazy.  |
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Post by g4hardcore on Nov 14, 2014 20:45:26 GMT
Extremely good points have been brought up, I'm impressed, have to admit.
I feel like regeneration is a good counter for durability, assuming Eren doesn't take too much damage. I know Humungousaur's got real limits to his durability by virtue of the fact that he will dodge attacks and use shields against certain weapons. As far as armor goes, the Armored Titan does have more vulnerable points, but they are laced throughout his body. It seems Ben's unarmored points are all focused in one general area, which isn't good if exposed to an onslaught of concentrated attacks. If I'm not mistaken, his neck and core seem to be the most exposed, the locations of most vital organs and vessels. On the other side, Eren is sort of like a walking, exposed nerve in that he has virtually no armor.
I don't think Ben would go smaller in the middle of a fight against a fellow giant. Tactically, the idea is sound, but it honestly doesn't seem like his style. I can't recall an insurance of him using that to throw any opponent off, not to say he's incapable.
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Post by Indolent on Nov 14, 2014 21:39:54 GMT
Actually, if you're referring to the tannish aspect of his flesh, those aren't weak. He's literally durable everywhere. Look at the stomach and chest: those are plates. He dodges anyways as that's always a great idea regardless as well. Heroes United gives us a better idea of how he actually looks. The animation style from there is also my favorite: EDIT: WTF, it gets shrinked. Here's a link then. >_> The weakest spot, so to speak, could be the neck though. How weak, dunno, considering the tannish aspect of his biceps look to be the same and they're fairly durable. It's debatable I guess but I'm sticking with being durable in general everywhere. le linkEh, it was an idea. He's proven to be crafty but I suppose if we need actual feat of him doing it... >_> Also I don't think he'll be ripping Eren apart, literally, so to speak in terms of bodily damage. It's going to be purely blunt and what have you. It's not Ben's style honestly. All he needs to do is knock him the hell out, and frankly, that's doable. Since I recall Annie taking him down like so? |
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Post by Andrew Hedin on Oct 12, 2020 1:43:51 GMT
Dude what the hell Humungosaur would stomp This Eren he is durable enough to survive a fall form the stratosphere which calculates to be multi city block level and is strong enough to knock a satellite space station out of orbit in the episode above and beyond which weighs over thousands of tons he is also stated to be stronger than swampfire who is strong enough to knock over the highbreed weather tower which calculates to weigh over 40,000 tons and to back this up he easily handled techadon robots in alien force where one of them gave Chromastone trouble where it was stated by dwane McDuffie that he is stronger than swampfire who is a thousand tonner and stated to be stronger than four arms who is strong enough to rag doll Enochs giant robot in the game protector of earth and he has fast reaction and can spin a wolly mammonth at hypersonic speed which weigh around 4 to 6 tons and is stronger than looma who can beat an entire planets worth of tetramand and four arms is strong enough to make a sonic clap that pushed back a giant weather monster in the episode monster weather And is durable enough to withstand a building collapsing on him and he also threw an alien bomb into orbit in Base form which would have gone into space if it hadn’t exploded In the episode pier pressure and was able to throw a necklace into outer space in a comic and the hoverboard is made out of some alien material so it must be heavy if it’s able to carry sunder and humungosaur withstand multiple missles from ultimate humungosaur where one of them ko diamondhead who can remain conscious after falling from earths orbit in the movie destroy all aliens and is stronger than wrath who can throw tanks and boulders three times his size with ease juggle a piano, an elephant, an anvil with ease and can one shot Jared the giant red alien in a comic once and you think he is slow Humungosaur reacted to lasers from malware after they are fired reacted to inspector 13’s laser after it was fired and Ben in human form has reacted to a time ray from eon, and his reaction speed is comparable to Kevin who can react to Light from Chromastone, and from a radiation blast form P’andor, and so what if he’s bullet proof humungousa has withstood lasers from weapons that are much more advance than an earth gun which delivers 300 petawatt a so Humungosaur stomps this Eren do research god if you say you haven’t watch the show then you should look up the characters feats and humungosaur and vilgax shook a city when they clashed so I am pretty sure humungosaur can beat this Eren
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